A White guy visiting the ghetto.

These concepts are socially constructed and have been given much weight. What are your thoughts?
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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 12:22 am

I understand working for things VERY well. I had to work for EVERYTHING growing up, and I still do. They dont call us working class for nothing.

And all the jews Ive met were from financialy well off families.
People from those kind of families dont have to struggle like people in my neck of the woods.

I can assume that you, living in the burbs and from a successful father, had life pretty easy compared to a mick like me. You have no idea what its like to be working class, in a sh*tty neighborhood, struggling for everything. Thats great that your father was once poor, but keep in mind, EVERYONE back then was broke back then. Especialy if he was around in the depression. Not a big deal.

And as far as the media and corporate positions, they are passed down. Dont try to give me any other bullsh*t.

Its real easy for you to sit in green acres and talk sh*t about my neighborhood. You never had to live it.
Your word on this subject, princess, is as valuable as dog sh*t.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 2nd, 2005, 12:31 am

Mick, I don't talk shit or anything else about your neighborhood.
I never go to your neighborhood. I don't go to Irish neighborhoods, mostly because honestly I don't know where there are any in New York.

As for it being "great" that my father grew up poor: no, it is not great.
I wish he had not. I wish he had had an easier life.

He also grew up in the suburbs, by the way. His family rented a tiny 1 bedroom apartment in a suburb of New York (a family of four), so that they could live near relatives and so he and his sister could go to a good (free) public school.

My parents also made sure we went to good public schools, since they revere education but could not afford to send us to private schools.

You see, that's what a lot of Jewish families do.
They will do anything to educate their families.
Live in a tiny apartment - both my parents' parents slept on a couch in the living room (giving the one bedroom in the house to the children so they would have some quiet to study and some semblance of a normal childhood), take out a loan to send their kid to college, move to a town (even if it means a tiny apartment or taking a loss on a move) that has halfway decent public schools, etc.
This is what Jews do - sacrifice for their children, especially for the sake of their education.
My parents did it for me, my sister is doing it for her son, and I will do it for my children.

That's the secret to "Jewish success".
Not government handouts or favors, or anything else.

Just good old fashioned hard work (which you claim to revere) plus some good planning and saving.

Oh, and laying off the bars doesn't hurt either.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 12:48 am

OOHHH. POOR JEWS....

4 in a suburban 1 bedroom apartment!!! Thats your definition of hard times!!!??? HAHAHAHAHA!!!! Try this.... My mother died when I was a baby. It was me, my two brothers, my pops, and my 3 cousins (their dad was locked up and was killed in prison 8 years later) in a TINY 2 bedroom apt. NOW..... We would have killed to be in a suburban area. HELL NO!!
We were on 44th. We had the city, and all the sh*t that city life brings with it. We were BROKE. NOTHING. My dad worked in a factory and my oldest brother and cousin worked odd jobs. I remember times when my older brother would steal subs from a deli he worked at, because if we spent cash on food, we wouldnt be able to pay rent. We were Irish boys in a working class neighborhood, so naturaly, we got into trouble alot. Schools had it out for us. I have 36 cousins altogether, and every school in the area was well aware of th O'Reiley boys. We got sh*t pinned on us all the time. hahaha. But our life was rough. Nothing like your suburban life, or your parents 4 to 1 bedroom in the burbs. I served a good amount of time in prison for a crime I admit to doing, but am not sorry for. I did what was nessasary. You have no idea what struggle is.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 2nd, 2005, 1:08 am

Mick, you are truly crazy.

You lived 7 people to a 2 bedroom apartment. My father (and mother by the way also) lived 4 people to a 1 bedroom apartment.
It's 3.5 people to a bedroom versus 4 people to a bedroom. What exactly is the difference?

By the way, my mother grew up in a working class neighborhood in the Bronx, not the suburbs. She also did just fine.
No one in my family has ever been to prison, although many grew up in working class neighborhoods.

Most Jews have not been to prison, and all of them lived in working class neighborhoods when they first immigrated or even the first generation born in America (like my parents).

It is unfortunate that so many people in your family - yourself included - have been to prison. Big problem.

Just because one grows up poor one does not have to get in trouble and go to prison like the "O'Reilly boys".

One could, instead, study hard and go to college and then work hard in a profession.

Avoid fights, trouble, *drinking*, *bars*, and prison, and you too maybe could succeed, just like the Jews!

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 1:28 am

^ See.. High and mighty. F*CK JEWS. AND F*CK YOU! I AM EARNING A DECENT LIVING NOW. I WOULD NEVER IN MY LIFE WANT TO BE ANYTHING LIKE THE JEWS. ONLY THING JEWS ARE GOOD FOR IS BAKING.

BY THE WAY, IN THE LAST 3 POSTS YOU MADE CRACKS AT BARS AND DRINKING. GOT ANYTHING ELSE TO SAY? I ADMIT IT. WE DRINK! IS THAT ALL YOU GOT TO SAY ABOUT US, CAUSE I COULD WRITE A LIST OF SH*T ABOUT KIKES.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 2nd, 2005, 1:36 am

Just curious: why do you drink so much?

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 1:47 am

Its fun. We enjoy a party. We socialize. What the f*cks it to you?

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 2nd, 2005, 1:56 am

Just curious is all.

I enjoy a party as much as the next person.
Jews are very social people in general.
However, for me, a party means good company, good music, good conversation, maybe good food. But drinking has nothing to do with it.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 2:01 am

Just cause someone drinks, doesnt mean they cant be successful.

Some of the brightest guys I know are regular marijuana users. College grads. Smart guys. Just cause you drink or smoke doesnt mean you are holding yourself back more than anyone else. I find it kinda funny you said that if we lay off the bottle, we'd be successful too. Didnt realize alcohol was the potion for failure.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 2:05 am

Its one thing if your an alcoholic, but there nothin wrong with having drinks in the bar with your buddies while watching the game.
Theres nothin wrong with workin your ass off all day and wanting to relax your muscles and mind with a glass of whiskey. Its relaxing. You get a buzz, you loosen up and you have fun with the boys.

I see nothing wrong with it.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 2nd, 2005, 2:10 am

I agree there's nothing wrong with having a drink occasionally.

The only danger is that alcohol is extremely addictive for some people. There is always the danger that one may become addicted. And we know what happens when people get addicted to any drug, be it alcohol, cocaine, heroin, etc. Complete and utter destruction of families, communities, careers, lives.

Also, I've read that Irish people do carry a gene which makes them disproportionately predisposed to getting addicted to alcohol/alcoholism.

This is the best reason for Irish people not to drink at all.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 2:14 am

Just outta curiousity, why couldnt you just say "a gene that makes them easily addicted to alcohol"?

Seems like your trying to use words to make yourself sound intellegent.
No offense, but if your going to chat with me, just be down to earth.
No need to impress anyone.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 2nd, 2005, 2:28 am

Sorry Mick.
I read a lot.
Basically all the time.
So I write the way I read - I use all kinds of words, both simple and more complex words.
Believe me, it's instinctive to me to use all the words in my vocabulary when I write.
It doesn't make me less down to earth as a person.
Actually, I think most people appreciate it because they realize this is my vocabulary and that I am not patronizing them by "dumbing down" the way I write or speak just to talk to certain people, so as not to "appear" snobby.
I am simply being myself.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 2:34 am

Well thats cool. People who do that in regular conversations come off as fakes to me. Trying to look smart. If you do that naturaly while typing, then I guess thats different.

You read The Westies before? Hell's Kitchen Irish mob. Great book.
You live in NY so you might find it interesting. Anyway I gotta go to sleep. I have to work tommorow. This is all the chatting I can do for tonight.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Cold Bear » May 2nd, 2005, 7:55 am

I got mixed feelings on Jews. I used to hate them so baaad. My boss at the time was a racist, greedy, penny-pinching ass Jew who exploited everybody he came into contact with. All the things you would hate stereotypically about a Jew. I heard this dude make racist remarks on Blacks, Puerto Ricans, Asians, Irish. And yes, Blacks do have issues with Jews. Forget the riots in Crown Heights?
http://www.ex-iwp.org/docs/1993/Crown%2 ... ermath.htm

But I understand they got their culture, and whatever it is that they do makes them succesful. I have no more hate for Jews. the average dollar changes hands 19 times in the community before coming outside of the community. This is tight knit and they help themselves before helping others.

I feel they smell themselves a lil too much, talking about them being the 'Chosen People' and applying that attitude to how they treat others. People forget that Zionists were terrorists and it was Jews who were the first terrorists in the Racist Zionist State otherwise known as Israel.

And yo, just to make clear, I got NO MORE HATE for them. Just some things I feel unjust is all.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 9:15 am

I agree with all that brother. And I thought i recalled issues between jews and blacks a while back.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 2nd, 2005, 11:09 am

I'm sure some black people have issues with Jews.
It seems lots of people have issues with us.
It's called anti-Semitism and it's as old as the history of time and as recent as Nazi Germany.

However, whatever you want to say about Jews: come to a Jewish neighborhood - *any* Jewish neighborhood - and we are not killing each other in the style of gangs like Bloods and Crips in black neighborhoods.

Enough said.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Cold Bear » May 2nd, 2005, 12:36 pm

I accepted my Anti-Semitism and moved past that. I have no hate for Jews at all. But what is your comment getting at here?

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Invincible » May 2nd, 2005, 12:47 pm

well the reason so much American support and money is going into Israel because of the high ranking jewish posisions and influence in the U.S

Personally I dont have anything against jews though.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Cold Bear » May 2nd, 2005, 1:12 pm

\ Forget about my harsh words on Jews, it was a byproduct and not the point of my post.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 2nd, 2005, 7:39 pm

Invincible wrote:well the reason so much American support and money is going into Israel because of the high ranking jewish posisions and influence in the U.S

Personally I dont have anything against jews though.



That is very true.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 3rd, 2005, 12:34 pm

Well, Jews are a small minority in the United States - only 2% of the population. So how much influence over the politics can we have?
It's true that Jews tend to be concentrated in certain states like New York, California, New Jersey, etc. I suppose there they could have more influence on the local politics at least and to some extent the state politics. But an American president can certainly win an election without the Jewish vote - it happens all the time. (every Republican president that we have had - Jews tend to vote Democrat).

Anyway, the Jewish and Israeli groups do have strong lobbyists and have been successful in persuading politicians to vote for policies that are favorable to Israel. But if they have succeeded in persuading them, it is because their arguments were good and the reasons for supporting Israel make sense.

Certainly Israel is one of the U.S.'s strongest allies (possibly its strongest ally after Canada), and you can be damn sure it's the only reasonable ally in the Middle East. It's the only country in the Middle East that even has a democratically elected government and is stable politically.
So the United States has every strategic reason to make sure Israel survives.

The U.S. also uses Israel as a military base - when I lived there I saw a lot of U.S. soldiers based in Haifa. How many other Middle Eastern countries could the U.S. use as a military base in that part of the world as easily and painlessly?

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by se11 » May 3rd, 2005, 12:36 pm

MICK wrote:
Invincible wrote:well the reason so much American support and money is going into Israel because of the high ranking jewish posisions and influence in the U.S

Personally I dont have anything against jews though.



That is very true.


actually the US original reason we've supported them since 1945 was because they became independant and they became democratic.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 3rd, 2005, 7:47 pm

What happened in 1945?

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by WhiteBoy » May 3rd, 2005, 7:56 pm

Rosieshosh wrote:What happened in 1945?


i hope your kidding but, ww2 ended.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 3rd, 2005, 7:57 pm

WhiteBoy wrote:
Rosieshosh wrote:What happened in 1945?


i hope your kidding but, ww2 ended.


LMAO

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 3rd, 2005, 11:44 pm

Mick, I hope *you're* kidding, but Israel didn't even exist until 1948, so the U.S. couldn't have supported "Israel" in 1945.

The U.N. voted to partition Palestine into a Jewish state (Israel) and an Arab state in 1947. The Jews accepted the partition, the Arabs did not, and the surrounding Arab countries (Egypt, Syria, Jordan) declared war on the Jewish state. The Jews won the war, but the Arabs held on to some of the territory (for example, Jordan kept the West Bank, an Egypt kept Gaza. It was only in 1967 that there was another war and Israel got these territories as a result).

Anyway, in 1948, Israel declared its independence from Britain, in May of 1948.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Invincible » May 4th, 2005, 1:43 am

se11 wrote:
MICK wrote:
Invincible wrote:well the reason so much American support and money is going into Israel because of the high ranking jewish posisions and influence in the U.S

Personally I dont have anything against jews though.



That is very true.


actually the US original reason we've supported them since 1945 was because they became independant and they became democratic.


democratic? lol.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by MICK » May 4th, 2005, 10:13 am

Rosieshosh wrote:Mick, I hope *you're* kidding, but Israel didn't even exist until 1948, so the U.S. couldn't have supported "Israel" in 1945.

The U.N. voted to partition Palestine into a Jewish state (Israel) and an Arab state in 1947. The Jews accepted the partition, the Arabs did not, and the surrounding Arab countries (Egypt, Syria, Jordan) declared war on the Jewish state. The Jews won the war, but the Arabs held on to some of the territory (for example, Jordan kept the West Bank, an Egypt kept Gaza. It was only in 1967 that there was another war and Israel got these territories as a result).

Anyway, in 1948, Israel declared its independence from Britain, in May of 1948.


Well, I dont give 2 sh*ts about Israel, I just knew that WW2 ended in 1945. Its an important date in my mind because of my family tree.

By the way, it was WHITEBOY who hoped you were kidding, so please dont give me anymore hebe history lessons. Thank You.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 4th, 2005, 11:41 am

Mick, please don't refer to Jews as Hebes. Thanks.

I thought it was you who wrote "I hope you're kidding". Sorry.

Anyway, I'll write the history lessons - to whoever chooses to read this tread - as long as people write innacurate things: like the U.S. supporting Israel since 1945.

As far as Israel being democratic: (someone else questioned this), it is.
All citizens of Israel have the right to vote, the elections are real (and not just phony elections with no real opposition to the leaders) unlike any of the other Middle Eastern countries with the exception of Turkey, and as a result the government changes every few years.
(This is in contrast to countries like Egypt, Syria, Jordan which have basically monarchies and dictatorships with power passed down in the families or not at all! Mubarak of Egypt has been in power since the 1970's!)

All citizens in Israel vote, and there are several Arab members of Parliament. (Arabs make up about 20% of the Israeli population).

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by se11 » May 4th, 2005, 12:30 pm

the US did support Isreal as soon as they became independant. they supported democracy during the cold war, so the US backed them. palestine invaded isreal many times but always failed. when six countries invaded isreal, do you think they could have defended themselvs successfully without US help.

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Re: A White guy visiting the ghetto.

Unread post by Rosieshosh » May 4th, 2005, 12:37 pm

se11, you are right: it would have been hard for Israel to successfully defend itself without U.S. support.

During the 1973 War (called the Yom Kippur War because Egypt, Jordan, and Syria launched a surprise attack against Israel on Yom Kippur, the most holy day of the Jewish year when everyone is fasting and off work), Israel suffered extreme setbacks and was in danger of losing the war.
(And when Israel loses a war it means it will no longer exist because the country is tiny - the size of New Jersey. It can't afford to lose any territory.)

Apparently Golda Meir asked the U.S. to send weapons but the U.S. refused.

Israel was in such a bad state in the war that it actually considered using nuclear weapons against its enemies.
It seems that Israel has and had at the time nuclear weapons, but did not have enough conventional weapons.

The choice would have been use nuclear weapons and "win" the war, or avoid using them and, due to the shortage of conventional weapons, lose the war.

Golda Meir was apparently unwilling to lose the war - she said that after the Holocaust Jews said "Never again", and meant it - so she threatened the U.S. to use nuclear weapons against Egypt, Syria, and Jordan unless the U.S. provided Israel with more conventional weapons.

The U.S. finally did, and the rest is history.

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