Faciulina wrote:Dobre wrote:Faciulina wrote:lol you hype balkan oc too much they are nothing special they are just gangs as others
who really rules europe is italian mafia especially the ndrangheta that control 80% of cocaine
italy is inside the UE and mafia members are inside UE parliament balkans are just shit holes, the turnover of ndrangheta alone is higher than any balkan country GDP
That may have been the case in the 70s and 80's but in 2015, it's much much different. Turkish OC in the 90's had 70 billion dollars a year in profits from drug trafficking alone, and the Turks aren't shit in the Balkans. As far as OC goes in Bulgaria, Macedonia, Albania, Montenegro and Serbia, if you don't believe me, go there and you'll see for yourself. I doubt you'll find a successful or popular business, especially nightclubs and restaurants, that are not owned by the mafia.
Their influence is huge, kind of like rap and street gangs' influence on North American youth and society in general nowadays.
As far as cocaine goes, yeah sure, maybe the Ndrangheta does, but not the heroin and you know for a fact that heroin is a bigger business in Europe than cocaine, vice versa in the US.
I guarantee you, go to any popular nightclub in these countries and you can tell who the criminals are just by looking around the club and you'd be surprised how many of them there are and how many of them are not actually regulars to the club just in case if you were wondering if their number is limited or they're just locals..
And in case you were also wondering, there are ALOT of nightclubs and restaurants in the Balkans. This is a tradition back home. In Stip alone, there are hundreds of restaurants, nightclubs and cafes, a city of 50,000 people. You can find restaurants and nightclubs on every corner. In just a 5 sq km stretch of land in Stip, Macedonia, you have San Remo Pizzeria, the "Italian restaurant", Parapoli, Ice Caffe Bar, Irish Pub Dublin, Casablanca, Classic Cafe, Alberta Pizzeria, Roma Pizzeria, Troika, Zaki, Vezilka, Square Pub, Cafe Bar Versaj, Cafe Bar Logo, Grof(Count Bistro), etc.
I'm not even going to go into another stretch of land, maybe 1 km in length, that has Restoran Longurov, Necko-2, Vago, Mal Odmor, etc.
All owned by gangsters or by people with familial connections to gangsters.
You multiply that by other Macedonian cities, like Strumica, Gevgelija, Kocani, Vinica, Veles, Prilep, Skopje, Tetovo, Gostivar, Kumanovo, Sveti Nikole, Ohrid, Struga, Debar, Kichevo, Kavadarci, Probistip, Negotino, well.. You get the idea..
In Ohrid, I've seen more Lambo's than in Sunny Beach, Bulgaria.
You go to Kosovo or Albania... End of story lol..
balkan oc run nightclubs in the balkans? and what? italian mafia runs everythings in italy drugs, construction companies,garbage, restaurants, discos, food industry they totally run the country
and italian mafia earn billion euros that is the biggest money in the world, it earns 200 billions a year more than any balkan country GDP
you're wrong, today cocaine is the most lucrative drug in europe and ndrangheta controls 80% of it...nobody uses heroin anymore not in western europe, maybe in the shit holes as the balkans are
turkish don't earn 70 billions a year maybe a couple of billion at most
There's facts to disprove everything you just said lol..
The Italian mafia, first and foremost, only controls about 3 percent of Italy's GDP. This is nothing to the 40 percent in Russia, or even greater percentages in the Balkan countries. It's not a matter of total profit but of total influence.
According to the FBI, the Italian mafia consists of about 25,000 made members and 250,000 associates worldwide, bringing the total number of people part of Italian organized crime to about 275,000. Yes, that's a huge number, but it's nothing given the size of Italy, Western Europe or North America, which is primarily where the Italian mafia operates, especially when you figure the bulk of these 275,000 people are concentrated in Italy, especially southern Italy and not elsewhere. This is my first point, the Italian mafia doesn't control everything in Italy, maybe in southern Italy and they're struggling there too and you can see that for a fact when the President of Sicily is Rosario Crocetta, an openly gay anti-mafia politician.
So in essence, yes, while the Italian mafia is a formidable power in today's world, it's state of being can be compared to today's Mexican drug cartels, which have considerable power in Mexico but are the constant target of police operations and raids, alongside that of other countries, just like the Italian mafia in Italy. They both have numbers but they don't have their own country. This is the very difference that makes groups like the Balkan groups and the Russian groups have longevity over Italian and Mexican groups.
Italy and Mexico are not mafia states but they have respective breeding grounds for future generations of mobsters and cartel members, but Russia, Macedonia, Bulgaria, Serbia, Bosnia and Herzigovina, Montenegro, Albania and Kosovo are.
By longevity I mean that the mob has total or almost total control of the state, and the mob culture is apparent in all facets of society. Who is there to crack down on them, even if the people are against the mob, when the very highest ranks of the government, parliament, police, military, intelligence and the business world composes of known mafia members?
Yes, the Italian mafia at one point was very powerful in America. This is probably what's confusing you. In the 1960's it was said that they could stop all shipping to the US since they controlled all the sea ports, and this is why it took the FBI and the government nearly a century to destroy them, because they were dealing with a very delicate situation. But the fact of the matter is that the Italian mafia in America was not unopposed, and that lead to their demise, just like it will eventually lead to the demise of the Italian mafia in Italy and the Mexican drug cartels in Mexico, because they have a sizable opposition that wants to do things differently, even if it's not nicer than the way the mob does things. With the US you could say it was the good old boys.
In countries like Russia, the mob runs unopposed. When you see numbers like 3 million in Russia and 300,000 abroad, you begin to realize the Russian mafia dwarves the Italian mafia in comparison - and even Balkan organized crime.
Secondly, the Italian mafia operates abroad where there's a large Italian community, obviously, and places like the US had mass waves of immigrants from Italy and the mob came with them. So while the Italian mob is primarily a southern Italian thing, it's still much more developed in terms of a diaspora.
Albania was an isolationist state similar to that of North Korea right now for 50 years in the past century and they never mixed historically to begin with, their history is mostly recent history, people seem to forget that. Any Albanian diaspora is relatively new, in fact almost 100 years newer than any Italian diaspora.
Same with Bulgaria and Yugoslavia; Bulgaria was part of the Warsaw Pact and as you're well aware, there was no freedom of movement between Eastern and Western blocs during the Cold War in terms of people, obviously lol.
Yugoslavia was neutral, but Yugoslavia had an amazing standard of living for a Socialist nation and relatively decent diplomatic standing with both East and West, and therefore there was no reason for Yugoslav citizens to immigrate. Some people I know actually denied 5x the salary they were getting in Yugoslavia to immigrate to the US, because it was more than enough for them if they stayed working that job in Yugoslavia during the 1970's, where you could compare it to the US of the 1950's, where you could pay off a house in 2 years, raise 2 kids and your wife would be a homemaker and live comfortably off of one salary.
Italy, on the other hand, has had mass migrations before on numerous occasions. Yes, there was many Macedonians who immigrated in mass migrations but nothing like that of Italy. Some of the earliest waves of Macedonians to Western countries were during the First Balkan War, and even then it was mostly kids, teenagers and young adults who had no idea of what a mafia culture was.
So the advantage any Italian groups have was the fact that they seized power during a time of technological blackout. I'd like to see the Italian mafia possess all the power they had 50 years ago in the US for example with modern surveillence and policing technology.
Thirdly, the Italian mafia makes over 100 billion dollars a year, not 200. The Russian mafia, does, however, launder about 250 billion dollars a year. Also, Italy is 60 million people. The Balkans is 60 million people, but borders exist between Balkan countries but there's no borders within the Italian peninsula. There's also no borders from Italy to the rest of the EU but there is for Balkan countries, and the same for ex Soviet republics.
Fourthly, how can you compare the earnings of a mafia group that is 275,000 strong in an industrialized Western country of 60 million people with visa free agreements with the US and Canada alongside the EU compare to that of a country of 2, 5, 10 million people, third world, where the average salary is 150 Euros a month? What is the mafia in the Balkan countries supposed to profit of when the salary of Balkan countries is 150-200 Euros a month compared to 1300 Euros in Italy? Don't forget Balkan countries are under quarantine, any business coming out of the Balkans being moved to Germany or some shit is bound to get double checked over an Italian business that requires 3x less forms, documents and waiting times because Italy is a EU country.
Fifth, Bulgaria might be a EU member, but Bulgaria used to be 10 million people prior to 2006 when they joined and in that past decade since then, 2.5 million people have moved out, but that's 2.5 million people across the EU, not just solely concentrated in one country like most immigration waves end up doing from a certain country. 2.5 million people spread out across the UK, Germany, Spain, Italy, France(together compose 316 million people) and the like is nothing in comparison to concentrating 2.5 million people in say Germany or France alone.
As far as Russia goes, Russia is 145 million people.
Turkey is the size of the Balkans area plus 17 million people, give or take, but we'll say for a fact that Turkey is not a mafia state, despite the 70 billion dollars a year they take in from drug trafficking.
The reason why the Turkish mafia is not internationally known is because their business is transit, not distribution, unlike that of the Italian or Russian mafia even though I realize the Russian mafia is more into fraud, arms and human trafficking instead of drug trafficking.
And that's exactly the answer to all your questions - Balkan organized crime groups have realized that it's way more lucrative in the long term to expand internationally using transit domestically for a constant base of low risk income.
The Italians are no longer number 1 or number 2 in Europe, even Western Europe - it's the Russian mafia who is number 1 in Europe and the Albanian mafia that is number 2 in Europe, but the Italian mob is still number 3, which is quite an achievement, and I'm talking about Western Europe minus Italy - given the fact that....the Serbian mafia almost became number 2 during the 1990's.
People forget that fact as well, how as a result of the Yugoslav Wars Serbian criminals nearly took over the underworld in Western Europe. I think the Serbian mafia in Scandinavia now is estimated to be at around 10,000 people, which is nothing when you think about it but still a pretty damn big achievement given the changes the Serbian mafia went through.
The Serbian mafia was at one point the strongest and biggest Balkan group thanks to the Yugoslav Wars - they dwarfed the Albanians and the Bulgarians both at home and abroad. Now they're still strong - 2nd in the Balkans to be sure after the Bulgarians out of the domestic groups and 3rd if you count the Russians in the equation when it comes to the Balkans. Why the Russians? Because they had the manpower and the money, that's why. Who could refuse them? Who would be crazy and suicidal enough?
The Albanians are the strongest group COMING from the Balkans, the fact that they're the strongest Balkan group at the moment is a common misconception. They have power and numbers in places like Albania, Kosovo and Western parts of Macedonia but that's about it. They have investments in eastern Macedonia, sure, but no presence, and the Bulgarians dwarf them in terms of muscle.
Macedonians are not even a speck in relation to these groups. For every Macedonian gangster, there's 5 Albanians, 7 Bulgarians and 10 Serbs. But our business is transit, not distribution.
During the wars, the West let in hundreds of thousands of Albanians in the 1990's, so while the Serbs were robbing banks and jewelry stores in Germany and France, the Albanians were getting settled in ghettos and shit.
It was only after 1998 when the US decided to take the KLA off of their terrorist blacklist and make them their ally that the Albanians all of a sudden gained mystical immunity from Western prosecution when it came to their organized crime activities.
This is why the Albanian mafia is the strongest Balkan mafia group internationally, it's not because they're capable, it's because they built up a massive distribution network while the Serbs and Bulgarians were busy killing eachother for who gets to take over the underworld in ex Yugoslav countries and Bulgaria.
Macedonians never had that problem, at least not to that extent. Yugoslavia, mob wise, is just a mini version of what happened in the ex Soviet Union when they fell apart with their mafia. Moscow had 3000 mafia related murders in 1994, you say? So did Belgrade.
So the first scenario is that the Albanians are using US backing as a way to temporarily get rich off of organized crime abroad, while the second scenario is that the US is actually helping them, but in both scenarios the US government is backing the Albanians to keep a balance in the Balkans against all the pro Russian Slavic countries like Serbia, Macedonia and Bulgaria.
Proxy warfare, but in a clandestine, semi guerilla, semi civil war, semi psychology war, semi economic and cultural warfare type of thing.
As far as cocaine being a lucrative business in Europe, where do you get your information lmao? Cocaine is always a lucrative business, but heroin is even more so in Europe.
Just check out this list
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... piates_use
Basically, countries like Germany have 240,000 heroin addicts since prevalence is another words for percentage of the population.
240,000 vs. 20,000 in Bulgaria, and you're saying maybe heroin is big amongst Balkan OC groups because people abuse it more in the Balkans???? You're kidding right...with what money shall they buy that heroin? Like I said, Balkan OC is primarily transit, just like Turkish OC.
Turks might be strong in Germany and the UK, but not that much, try going against them in Instanbul on their home turf.
Same goes for why the Italian mafia or Hells Angels or Crips or Bloods or the Russian mafia never opened up a local, manned chapter in Macedonia, for example.
It just wouldn't happen. Look at people like Saso Mijalkov, which are said to be worth billions of dollars but you can't prove his wealth, they're phantoms. They're not just shady as fuck, they're extraterrestrial in nature. You can't go against a man who had half the Ukranian mafia behind him, who built up a whole city block in downtown Prague, whose nickname is the Joker, and whom you know absolutely nothing about and not even the CIA can touch, who has backing from people like the Hapsburg dynasty.
How is your mafia going to go against a guy who has the entire military and police force of a nation under his command, even if it's a small nation we're talking about 20,000 military and 12,500 police officers.
Also, in terms of how the transit business work, when your cousin is the prime minister, when your uncle runs customs, when your brother in law is the chief of organized crime investigations, so on and so fourth, you can tackle a foreign group from all sides and put them in checkmate before they virtually seize power of this small strip of land, this shit stain on the map, that is very important to the drugs, arms and human trafficking.
And you don't need alot of manpower or gadgets either when you're on your own home turf.
Each city of about 40-50,000 people or more in Macedonia, and there's at least 10 of them, has at least 1000 people involved in organized crime to a lesser or greater extent. Everybody contributes to the overall picture one way or another, even if they're just decoys.
You have 20-30 millionaires or multimillionaires in each town and city, and these are the head guys. Stip, for example, has over 100 textile factories but how many of these are really important? Bargala AD, which has 1200 workers, makes shoes and a legitimate profit of 250 million Euros a year but their owner is not a boss, he's more of a capo, out of those 20-30 people, hell even 50 people.
Together you make sure they run business since a large portion of the workforce is working for one of their many companies.
When you have a monopoly on things like trucking and logistics, and the head of customs is married into your family, you can give very specific orders to the heads of certain border crossings which trucks to check and which not to.
When you have 150 trucks in your expedition fleet, what then? What truck to check first? When you personally know and deal with the heads of customs for Bulgaria, Serbia, Turkey, Bosnia, Montenegro, Croatia, Romania, you name it, how can you be unsure that your drugs won't make it across?
Even if each transit boss or committee, be it the Macedonian ones that control all drugs and vice coming through eastern Macedonia, a region of nearly 400,000 people, receive a measly 2 percent of the total worth of all drugs being trafficked, that's still billions of dollars a year in their pocket since we're talking tons and the GDP has nothing to do with it.
If the US had solid intelligence on mob bosses running tons of heroin every month through Macedonia, believe me, they would've bombed the fuck out of all those fancy baroque hotels with the red banquet halls in Macedonia right now and said that they were harboring terrorists or some shit, but the fact that the US built an embassy in Skopje that goes 15 floors into the mountain under Saso Mijalkov's watch tells you something.
When every little kid can tell you who the big boss in their town is but they remain free and alive, you know something is up, and we all know that the US invaded Afghanistan for the heroin trade, not much else.