Who Do You Consider A Black Leader Today?

[Old Shatterhand]

I concede that being Black affords valuable insights

END OF STORY! Until you are born Black, raised around Black people, experience racism because of your Blackness, and know how most Black people think about social issues, including the influence of christianity in the Black community, then you have no right to criticize a Black man who does.

--> I'm not trying to be smart here. It is true that I am criticizing what you are saying. But it is constructive criticism given because I care. It's not done in arrogance or with any negative connotation. Understand I give and I receive based on what I deem to be true without attacking the giver and I hope you do to. Wisdom demands it. If I disagree I am able to state why and it certainly is not personal. I agree that context is important and you are making an assertion here based on a certain context; however, the right to criticize information (think of information as data arranged correctly or incorrectly by intelligence) is a basic right all persons have. It's the right to criticize you personally that perhaps I do not have. I'll allow that for the purposes of this discussion.


Your response shows that you have NO CLUE as to what I’m talking about, and I won’t allow you to drag me into a religious discussion!

--> Friend, I only respond to what I read. Maybe I missed something. np.

['X']

I concede that being Black affords valuable insights

END OF STORY! Until you are born Black, raised around Black people, experience racism because of your Blackness, and know how most Black people think about social issues, including the influence of christianity in the Black community, then you have no right to criticize a Black man who does.

Well said brutha....

[L Grindin]

Well said brutha....

Thanks Black Man.

I'm not trying to be smart here. It is true that I am criticizing what you are saying. But it is constructive criticism given because I care. It's not done in arrogance or with any negative connotation. … I agree that context is important and you are making an assertion here based on a certain context;

Friend, I only respond to what I read. Maybe I missed something. np.

Good intentions are fine. But if you truly care, you must accept that you may be ignorant of the reality that exists for Black people. What you did, which is a naïve mistake done by many non-Black people, especially White people, is you removed race from the larger context of social issues that Black people face. Race pervades more aspects of our lives than you may realize, or want to accept, and many things cannot be discussed with us if you don’t understand life as we see it, and as we live it.

[Tre]

This was a recent poll of Blacks from February 2006 asking who they consider the most important black leader (dead or alive):

Top leaders:

Jesse Jackson, 15%
Condoleezza Rice, 11%
Colin Powell, 8%
Barack Obama, 6%
Louis Farrakhan, 4%
Oprah Winfrey, 3%
Martin Luther King Jr., 3%
Al Sharpton, 2%
Others, 14%
Not sure, 21%
No one, 13%

Someone explain to me what have Jesse Jackson and/or Colin Powell actually done in the last year to get such high approval?

And how did Oprah Winfrey tie with Dr. King?

I understand there was actually more women than men polled in this survey. I think the ratio was women (55%) over men (45%). This would explain Oprah Winfrey running neck and neck with Dr. King..... Oprah gives Black women a sense of empowerment. Also, this would explain how Condoleeza Rice edged out with 11% when she’s not even black?? And we all know black women love them some Jesse 15%

['X']

Well said brutha....

Thanks Black Man.

So he responded to everything but the question of is he "kemosave" huh? These dudes trip me out with these multiple user names as if their post dont all sound the same. I know of a couple of others who doing the same thing on here too...

[L Grindin]

Well said brutha....

Thanks Black Man.

So he responded to everything but the question of is he "kemosave" huh? These dudes trip me out with these multiple user names as if their post dont all sound the same. I know of a couple of others who doing the same thing on here too...

That's the second time that someone who changed their name has avoided answering that question...It makes me wonder why they changed their name.

Do you, or anyone else, know who those guys are with the black, grey and white fatigues that stand around between Crenshaw & Slauson and the Baldwin Hills Crenshaw Plaza? I've been seeing them around for the past few years, but have never heard anyone say anything about them.

[Old Shatterhand]

Well said brutha....

Thanks Black Man.

I'm not trying to be smart here. It is true that I am criticizing what you are saying. But it is constructive criticism given because I care. It's not done in arrogance or with any negative connotation. … I agree that context is important and you are making an assertion here based on a certain context;

Friend, I only respond to what I read. Maybe I missed something. np.

Good intentions are fine. But if you truly care, you must accept that you may be ignorant of the reality that exists for Black people. What you did, which is a naïve mistake done by many non-Black people, especially White people, is you removed race from the larger context of social issues that Black people face. Race pervades more aspects of our lives than you may realize, or want to accept, and many things cannot be discussed with us if you don’t understand life as we see it, and as we live it.

I do care and your post is acknowledged (means taken to heart). Thank you for explaining that to me like you did. You know... I can get my information right but if I'm not listening then I know I'm missing a very important piece of the puzzle that leads to positive change. An ancient apologist once wrote that he could travel the world teaching nothing but truth and performing great deeds but without love it gained him nothing. Peace.

[Old Shatterhand]

Well said brutha....

Thanks Black Man.

So he responded to everything but the question of is he "kemosave" huh? These dudes trip me out with these multiple user names as if their post dont all sound the same. I know of a couple of others who doing the same thing on here too...

I didn't think it was important but since it's come up yes I started as wcrockets moderating here and then grew out of that and took a new name kemosave then outgrew that and took a third name that I think reflects where I am at better.

The rationale is that as I've progressed in education and experience I eventually come to a place where I don't believe a nick and some of what I may have posted under that nick accurately reflects new understanding of truth nor myself really any longer so I dump it and take a new one that does. I've never posted with an old one after taking a new one and currently only posting on this forum. I believe staying in the same place isn't desirable but progressing is. It's how I feel and it is reflected in my decision to progress through the three nicks. I hope that clears that up. Peace.

[MiChuhSuh]

This was a recent poll of Blacks from February 2006 asking who they consider the most important black leader (dead or alive):

Top leaders:

Jesse Jackson, 15%
Condoleezza Rice, 11%
Colin Powell, 8%
Barack Obama, 6%
Louis Farrakhan, 4%
Oprah Winfrey, 3%
Martin Luther King Jr., 3%
Al Sharpton, 2%
Others, 14%
Not sure, 21%
No one, 13%

Someone explain to me what have Jesse Jackson and/or Colin Powell actually done in the last year to get such high approval?

And how did Oprah Winfrey tie with Dr. King?

I understand there was actually more women than men polled in this survey. I think the ratio was women (55%) over men (45%). This would explain Oprah Winfrey running neck and neck with Dr. King..... Oprah gives Black women a sense of empowerment. Also, this would explain how Condoleeza Rice edged out with 11% when she’s not even black?? And we all know black women love them some Jesse 15%

LOL

the results were disturbing.... but technically it was "most important" and not "best"

so maybe rice and Collin Powell are "important" in just being black and in the cabinet and Powell coming from Harlem and going to college only with aid, and not based on what they do.

lol @ what you said about jesse and oprah...

[MiChuhSuh]

Do you, or anyone else, know who those guys are with the black, grey and white fatigues that stand around between Crenshaw & Slauson and the Baldwin Hills Crenshaw Plaza? I've been seeing them around for the past few years, but have never heard anyone say anything about them.

?

Was it a real obvious group or just random people? Last time I went I never noticed it. When do they stand there?

[L Grindin]

Do you, or anyone else, know who those guys are with the black, grey and white fatigues that stand around between Crenshaw & Slauson and the Baldwin Hills Crenshaw Plaza? I've been seeing them around for the past few years, but have never heard anyone say anything about them.

Was it a real obvious group or just random people? Last time I went I never noticed it. When do they stand there?

They weren't random people; they are definitely a group, and in addition to the fatigues, some carry red, black and green flags and wear red, black and green wristbands. They always dress alike and they appear to be in their late teens and early 20's. Everytime I go down Crenshaw I see them out there, on both weekdays and weekends. About two years ago I went to an event about police brutality in Lemeirt Park, where a lot of NOI members were in attendance, and the folks with fatigues came in there. I saw them march in the MLK Day Parade together, and they were shown on that FX show "Black White" marching together, raising the black fist and yelling "Black Power." The deepest I've ever seen them is about 8 deep, and nobody I know seems to know who they are.

[MiChuhSuh]

O I thought you meant they were outside the mall everyday

Hm... if they're just 8 deep them it's a small movement, I probably wouldn't have noticed them just passing by if I didn't already know they were there.

Unless they're NOI, then maybe only they know about their own little group.

['X']

Unless they're NOI, then maybe only they know about their own little group.

A "L Grindin", I'll hit you on pm with who them bruthas are.....

[L Grindin]

Unless they're NOI, then maybe only they know about their own little group.

A "L Grindin", I'll hit you on pm with who them bruthas are.....

Alright

[MiChuhSuh]

Unless they're NOI, then maybe only they know about their own little group.

A "L Grindin", I'll hit you on pm with who them bruthas are.....

So I'm guesing it's bigger than 8 guys

lol whatever @

[UmanH-ay]

I didn't think it was important but since it's come up yes I started as wcrockets moderating here and then grew out of that and took a new name kemosave then outgrew that and took a third name that I think reflects where I am at better.

so your WCROCKETS? didnt you say you werent going to moderate on here? and announced you left? oh well, but yo shatterhand, you can change your name in your profile at the top of the screen.

[whoknows]

Blacks must first stand up for blacks, if there is ever going to be any real respect. How can one take a nation of people serious, if the group is not serious among themselves. I'm not talking about a few individuals, I'm talking about the masses. Many blacks don't have respect for other blacks, so how can we expect "the establishment to follow suit."

agreed.. and a leader should stand up 4 the entire black race regardless of his belief. noi or muslim.

[whoknows]

meant christian or noi.

[whoknows]

What's the difference: Blacks call each other "nigga's" 24-7 and have learned to accept this Jim Crow term as a term of endearment. So why should we expect others not too?

most blacks who are proud 2 b black and have knowledge of self don't go around calling each other that. i get caught up saying it sometimes but i wouldn't go out calling my elders or a black militant that.

[whoknows]

The first step is preventative. Don't Get A Felony. Why do we take this for granted? Fools get locked up everyday, and we are still not getting the message. What does it takes to learn the message? Now, that the felony has been earned....Now what? It's time to get some serious professional help. A life coach, couselor, mentor, or some other type of resource manager. There are programs specifically geared towards helping out ex cons.

it's hard 2 prevent young brothers in the hood from getting a felony when we are lacking guidance. most blacks come from a household where 1 or both parents are in jail, the house has a single parent that works 2 jobs or where kids are having kids. so what kind of guidance can we get to follow the right path when parents are hardly in our lives or where babies are listening 2 their kid parents talking about they want 2 b like 50 cent and sell dope and shoot nigga's?

[whoknows]

i don't know why people always say that poor foreigners come here cause they see opportunity. what opportunity?

That's my point. You don't see it. Take a trip out of the country, live with the people (not a resort or tourist commuity), when you return, you may see it then.

i don't see what?

are u saying that coming from a poor country 2 live in a rich country and still b poor is opportunity? the only poor foreigners that benefit is the ones with a degree... because that muslim taxi cab driver shore didn't neither did the mexican border hopper painting houses or picking fruit for 2 dollars and hour.

[L Grindin]

What's the difference: Blacks call each other "nigga's" 24-7 and have learned to accept this Jim Crow term as a term of endearment. So why should we expect others not too?

most blacks who are proud 2 b black and have knowledge of self don't go around calling each other that.

I like how you put that. Too many Blacks have forgotten the history behind that term.

[Old Shatterhand]

I didn't think it was important but since it's come up yes I started as wcrockets moderating here and then grew out of that and took a new name kemosave then outgrew that and took a third name that I think reflects where I am at better.

so your WCROCKETS? didnt you say you werent going to moderate on here? and announced you left? oh well, but yo shatterhand, you can change your name in your profile at the top of the screen.

I'm not moderating no. I outgrew that nick and wanted to participate in the forum as a member. I'm a stronger better man today than I was a few years ago. Better educated and looking forward to the future. That's funny I missed that you could change your nick in the profile though.. shows we never stop learning.

['X']

What's the difference: Blacks call each other "nigga's" 24-7 and have learned to accept this Jim Crow term as a term of endearment. So why should we expect others not too?

most blacks who are proud 2 b black and have knowledge of self don't go around calling each other that.

I like how you put that. Too many Blacks have forgotten the history behind that term.

Very true statement "whoknows". That little sentence above sums it all up and thats the reason for how I was able to stop using that word and the word "cuzz" too...

[Tre]

What's the difference: Blacks call each other "nigga's" 24-7 and have learned to accept this Jim Crow term as a term of endearment. So why should we expect others not too?

most blacks who are proud 2 b black and have knowledge of self don't go around calling each other that.

I like how you put that. Too many Blacks have forgotten the history behind that term.

Very true statement "whoknows". That little sentence above sums it all up and thats the reason for how I was able to stop using that word and the word "cuzz" too...

I used to think that way too X. But that word holds a deeper truth..... meaning that goes back to the dawn of civilization itself! I understand why the white man 'unconsciously' uses it to degrade us, and why we shouldn't trip off bruthaz using it today. With all things there's a greater truth that lies beneath the surface.

I'll e-mail u the info 'X'

[A Ghost]

Who Do You Consider A Black Leader Today?

Wayne Brady

[Common Sense]

I can only assume that you are joking. I've really been against looking up to celebrities as leaders. Many of them have more problems than common people.

[A Ghost]

I can only assume that you are joking. I've really been against looking up to celebrities as leaders. Many of them have more problems than common people.

Yes, I am joking